Identification of the "Old British Gentleman"


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Johan Melle
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Identification of the "Old British Gentleman"

Post by Johan Melle » 02/04/2023, 2:31

I have discovered the identity of the so-called Old British Gentleman. Well... sort of.

As it turns out, he is indeed British. He was in fact the father of John Gayford, who worked with English dubbing in Rome for around 40 years. I discovered this by chance when I was going through John's Facebook page and discovered that in 2012, he had posted this picture of his dad, and he is definitely our unknown bit part player:
Mr Harry.jpg

Together with the photo, John wrote: "Daddy did lots of little parts in various films here in the seventies, even worked with Rock Hudson, but no dialogue in that one! However, although this looks like great casting for a Russian Spy film, I took the picture, so I know it's not. But what a face my dad had, it belonged on Mount Rushmore!"

I was in contact with John for a while prior to his death, but he never mentioned his father and I never had the idea to ask him. All I know is that his father was a military man, stationed in India, which was where John spent much of his childhood. John also posted this picture of his dad on Facebook, writing that: "It was actually taken at the Bombay film studios when he appeared in a recruiting film he wrote in 1942. He also put together a lot of shows to entertain the troops and keep up morale!" So clearly, he had an interest in acting even back then.
Mr Harry2.jpg

I asked dubbing actor Rodd Dana if he remembers John's father and whether he, too, used to work with dubbing, and showing him our topic. He recognized him at once and wrote: "John’s dad was a delightful character who just ‘popped’ into Rome on occasion. I don’t know if he did any dubbing, but I recall he was around frequently in dubbing ‘salas’ and frequently at the “Colony” restaurant where & when we all went for lunch. He was a bright, witty, and delightfully intelligent character. I seem to recall he had done some work in British cinema, but not certain."

Unfortunately, Rodd doesn't remember his name, and John never stated it in the comments he wrote on Facebook, leaving us in the curious situation where he know a person's identity but not his name, so not sure what to do with this...

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Ciavazzaro
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Identification of the "Old British Gentleman"

Post by Ciavazzaro » 02/04/2023, 3:02

This is very interesting.
A curios situation indeed a half identification, at least we know his surname

I will try to ask on the website dedicated to found and identify british generici, let's see if they know him !

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Identification of the "Old British Gentleman"

Post by PeplumParadise » 02/04/2023, 10:44

Johan Melle wrote:
02/04/2023, 2:31
I have discovered the identity of the so-called Old British Gentleman. Well... sort of.

As it turns out, he is indeed British. He was in fact the father of John Gayford, who worked with English dubbing in Rome for around 40 years. I discovered this by chance when I was going through John's Facebook page and discovered that in 2012, he had posted this picture of his dad, and he is definitely our unknown bit part player:
Mr Harry.jpg


Together with the photo, John wrote: "Daddy did lots of little parts in various films here in the seventies, even worked with Rock Hudson, but no dialogue in that one! However, although this looks like great casting for a Russian Spy film, I took the picture, so I know it's not. But what a face my dad had, it belonged on Mount Rushmore!"

I was in contact with John for a while prior to his death, but he never mentioned his father and I never had the idea to ask him. All I know is that his father was a military man, stationed in India, which was where John spent much of his childhood. John also posted this picture of his dad on Facebook, writing that: "It was actually taken at the Bombay film studios when he appeared in a recruiting film he wrote in 1942. He also put together a lot of shows to entertain the troops and keep up morale!" So clearly, he had an interest in acting even back then.
Mr Harry2.jpg


I asked dubbing actor Rodd Dana if he remembers John's father and whether he, too, used to work with dubbing, and showing him our topic. He recognized him at once and wrote: "John’s dad was a delightful character who just ‘popped’ into Rome on occasion. I don’t know if he did any dubbing, but I recall he was around frequently in dubbing ‘salas’ and frequently at the “Colony” restaurant where & when we all went for lunch. He was a bright, witty, and delightfully intelligent character. I seem to recall he had done some work in British cinema, but not certain."

Unfortunately, Rodd doesn't remember his name, and John never stated it in the comments he wrote on Facebook, leaving us in the curious situation where he know a person's identity but not his name, so not sure what to do with this...
Great information, but surely this should be posted into his topic rather than starting a separate one

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Identification of the "Old British Gentleman"

Post by Johan Melle » 02/04/2023, 16:24

Ciavazzaro wrote:
02/04/2023, 3:02
This is very interesting.
A curios situation indeed a half identification, at least we know his surname
Yes, although his surname would not actually be Gayford, but Harry since John's full birth name was John Gayford Harry.

PeplumParadise wrote:
02/04/2023, 10:44
Great information, but surely this should be posted into his topic rather than starting a separate one
Yes, to be integrated into the bio post in his topic, of course, but I'm entirely sure how to proceed with the topic. Should he remain with the unidentifieds or not? I also feel a new topic name would be appropriate, but haven't quite managed to decide on something. John wrote that his dad retired from the army with rank of Brigadier, so I suppose "Brigadier Harry" could be a possibility until we - hopefully - can find out his real name.

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Identification of the "Old British Gentleman"

Post by FatmanDan » 02/04/2023, 16:26

That's a great idea! Do you know *where* his son John was born?
(btw, if the Rock Hudson thing is correct, that would be ´Hornets' nest` - or `Come September`???)

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Identification of the "Old British Gentleman"

Post by PeplumParadise » 02/04/2023, 16:38

Johan Melle wrote:
02/04/2023, 16:24

Yes, to be integrated into the bio post in his topic, of course, but I'm entirely sure how to proceed with the topic. Should he remain with the unidentifieds or not? I also feel a new topic name would be appropriate, but haven't quite managed to decide on something. John wrote that his dad retired from the army with rank of Brigadier, so I suppose "Brigadier Harry" could be a possibility until we - hopefully - can find out his real name.
Until his actual name is found I guess he will still have to remain with the unidentified, but I agree he should be re-named. If John Gayford's real name is John Gayford Harry, then surely wouldn't his father be Brigadier Gayford Harry? It certainly seems like a double-barrelled surname as I've never heard of Gayford being a christian name.

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Identification of the "Old British Gentleman"

Post by van den bremt rudy » 03/04/2023, 21:12

Regarding Old British gentleman.
Today i have e-mailed the British embassy in Brussels for information about John Gayford Harry's father.
Maybe they can find something in british organizations the name of his father.
Hopefully i get an answer and fingers crossed, maybe his full name or they won't bother to inform me about such matters.
But it's worth a try, don't you think.

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Identification of the "Old British Gentleman"

Post by Johan Melle » 04/04/2023, 21:31

FatmanDan wrote:
02/04/2023, 16:26
That's a great idea! Do you know *where* his son John was born?
(btw, if the Rock Hudson thing is correct, that would be ´Hornets' nest` - or `Come September`???)
John was born in England but brought up in India.
As for the film, my bet would be on Hornet's Nest. Been meaning to look for him in it, but haven't gotten around to it yet.

PeplumParadise wrote:
02/04/2023, 16:38
Until his actual name is found I guess he will still have to remain with the unidentified, but I agree he should be re-named. If John Gayford's real name is John Gayford Harry, then surely wouldn't his father be Brigadier Gayford Harry? It certainly seems like a double-barrelled surname as I've never heard of Gayford being a christian name.
I don't think so. I've found a newspaper article from the Oxford Mail in 1950 about John landing his first acting role, and he is referred to as "John Gayford Harry, son of Brig. and Mrs. F. L. Harry." His mother gives a comment and is referred to simply as "Mrs. Harry".

van den bremt rudy wrote:
03/04/2023, 21:12
Regarding Old British gentleman.
Today i have e-mailed the British embassy in Brussels for information about John Gayford Harry's father.
Maybe they can find something in british organizations the name of his father.
Hopefully i get an answer and fingers crossed, maybe his full name or they won't bother to inform me about such matters.
But it's worth a try, don't you think.
I can't imagine that the British embassy in Brussels can be of any help here as I don't think John or his parents ever lived in Brussels, but it never hurts to try!

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Identification of the "Old British Gentleman"

Post by van den bremt rudy » 04/04/2023, 22:28

I have checked once more Hornet's nest but couldn't find the old gentleman in this.
Could it be rather A farewell to arms (1957) that was also filmed in Italy ?

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Identification of the "Old British Gentleman"

Post by van den bremt rudy » 05/04/2023, 1:01

The Rock Hudson movie must be "Ruba al prossimo tuo" (1968) where Rock has this short scene with the old man in jail with white-grey hair, who i believe must be our friend Old British gentleman, where indeed he has no dialogue.
Here the pictures :
vlcsnap-2023-04-05-00h51m50s574 1.png
vlcsnap-2023-04-05-00h52m05s627 1.png
vlcsnap-2023-04-05-00h52m45s902 1.png
Not so visible with the jail bars before him.
What do you think ?

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